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Post by deepthoughts 03/01/12, 08:12 pm

After thinking about the discussion in the 11-25 FBR post and the invaluable contribution of bwgophers (See Post) regarding what happened in the 01 group, I believe the following:

1) The teams already in the top 30 are odds-on-favorites to make Lake Highlands Girls Classic League come summer qualifying tournament - the number of teams ranked below 30 that made it was only one last year

2) Playing in LHGCL gives a DD an improved chance of playing soccer for her high school varsity team over Plano PPL or Arlington - the higher the LH division, the better

3) If a team missed in qualifying, very few teams from Plano or Arlington ever get to LHGCL D3, fewer yet rise to D2, and virtually none make it to LHGCL D1

4) If a team misses in first year qualifying, it get progressively harder in the future as LH reduces the number of teams in the league in older brackets

5) If you have a star kid that dominates in LHGCL D3, Plano, or Arlington -- you need to move up to another team the following year -- your odds are much better moving your DD than your team moving up a league.

6) Even now, the same dynamic holds true -- Parents of "star" kids and "very good" kids on teams below #25 are best served by trying out for teams ranked 1 - 20 -- being in the top 20 seems to virtually guarantee the all-important Lake Highlands qualification, barring a total team meltdown. Few teams will displace top 20 teams in this final spring season before going select.


So far, I think the top points are pretty much set in stone. If anyone disagrees, please comment.

Here are the questions that I do have:

A) Is it better to be a bench sub getting a bit less than 50% play time on a top 10 team, or a starter on a 10 - 25 team?

B) Is it better to be a star player on the #19 team, or just one of the cogs (not standing out) on the #9 team?

C) How much does harmony with the parents and the kids really matter? Should you stay on Team Harmony that is ranked #27 or #28, or move to a more difficult situation with crazy competitive parents on team #8. It seems that the higher ranked the team, the more crazy competitive the parents are. Is it simply the price you must pay to be on a top team?

D) Is it easier to move now, before spring starts, or should a person try to play his or her DD on as many teams / guest roles as possible throughout the spring before committing to a team? I have seen a number of parents that have a DD on three teams - does this work out better or worse?

My gut feel is that simply being on a team in the top 20 is what's most important. Being in the top 20 looks like it means you are very likely to not miss out on LH D3, even if the team has a nightmare QTourney. In year one of select, the top 20 teams all compete in the expanded 20 team LH D1 bracket. It does not feel like you must get to a top 10 or top 5 team right now. What are your thoughts?
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Post by Guest 03/01/12, 08:40 pm

1. Coach and developement(Do your research and choose the coach that is best for your DD!)
2. Minutes on the field ( the game is the best teacher )
3. DD enjoys the game and is excited about playing
4. If your looking at change before QT's start NOW!

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Post by Guest 03/01/12, 08:43 pm

Here's a very similar discussion from the '01's last Spring going into select. Covers you questions A-C quite a bit. Not so much on D, but would agree with TS... the sooner you can settle on a good home for U11, the better and less stressful for all...

http://www.txsoccer.net/t5858-key-contributor-or-role-player

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Post by deepthoughts 04/01/12, 06:52 am

bwgophers wrote:Here's a very similar discussion from the '01's last Spring going into select. Covers you questions A-C quite a bit. Not so much on D, but would agree with TS... the sooner you can settle on a good home for U11, the better and less stressful for all...

http://www.txsoccer.net/t5858-key-contributor-or-role-player

Thanks so much for pointing out the above thread. Your post from the 01 thread last year, which I will re-post below, is one of the best I've read in quite some time. I truly believe finding a positive environment is important and finding families with like-minded values is critical, but it is easy to lose sight of these things when the reality of "making it into Lake Highlands" becomes such a priority as qualifying tournament draws near.

bwgophers wrote:Perhaps a slightly different perspective from my side (perhaps not)...

As we look at having to invest significant money & time in the coming years, our decision is driven first and foremost by what is best for our DD's development as a person. Her development as a soccer player is a distant second.

1) Is she having fun?
2) Is she having fun? (yes, I repeated myself on purpose)
3) Is the environment surrounding this team the type of environment where we want our DD to spend a significant amount of time over the coming years?
3a) Are the kids on the team the type of kids we want our DD to hang out with?
3b) By default, the coach is going to be a role-model in her life. Is he/she the type of person we want teaching our DD, having our DD look up to, and having our DD emulate their behavior?
3c) Are the other parents the type of people that we want to spend significant time with, and want our DD to be around, looking up to, emulating their behavior?
4) Being associated with this team, will she learn the proper positive values of teamwork, leadership, and sportsmanship that will help her grow and mature as a young lady and grow her self-confidence?
5) Is this going to provide lasting positive memories for her about her childhood?

Then comes the soccer stuff:

6) Is she having fun? (that may or may not be directly tied to playing time, depends on the DD)
7) Does she enjoy the practices as well as the games?
8 ) Is she being challenged in practices and games?
9) Do we see steady improvement/development in her skills and game play?
10) When she does play, is she contributing on the field? If she is absolutely dominating or getting dominated, then I would naturally want to look for a different situation, but the other factors I mentioned above would still carry far more weight in the decision.

11) Is she playing? I have to be honest and admit that there's a small part of me that says if I'm going to start paying $3k a year and driving her all over the place to practice/games, etc... I'm going to want her on the field. But again, it's farther down the list if the other factors are being met.

As long as all of the above are being met, I could care less whether she's playing in LH D1, LH D3, PPL, Rec, whatever. I could care less whether her team is 100-0, 50-50, or 0-100 (o.k. maybe not 0-100 Very Happy, but the point is that winning isn't what it's all about).

The elusive college scholarship is not the end all for us. If she's got the ability, and more importantly, the drive, to be considered for something like that, it will show in the coming years and we will address it accordingly.

To be cliche, for us, it's much more about the journey than the destination.

There is a need for a lot of players to jump teams, but finding the "right" team to jump to is very hard with so little time left.
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Post by rcjctcac 04/01/12, 07:49 am

Great comments from past and current. I realize we made the right decision for our DD. Though we are not in Lake Highlands or in PPL1 (we are PPL2).We are loving our coach, parents and atmosphere.Maybe we'll break the mold and make it into Lake Highlands. cheers
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Post by weatherbug 04/01/12, 07:52 am

Wow, remember when the 01s used to post and have lively discussions?? pirat

For 02s considering when to move, earlier is definitely easier in terms of lessening worry about teams making and finding a good home for your daughter. However, for the 01s I think all but just a few very established teams had about 2-4 openings after the spring season that they needed to fill. There will be open spots on teams... you just won't have the benefit of playing league games with the team to see what kind of role your daughter will really play for that coach/team.

For 01s, I don't imagine there will be as much movement on current select teams at the end of the soccer year, but I would think that it is wise to reevaluate your daughter's place even on her select team each year. It's just a much shorter time frame to look for teams and make a switch, isn't it?!?

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Post by bigtex75081 04/01/12, 08:04 am

With all other things being equal (enjoyment, cost, practice location, etc.) I would probably take my DD to the team she plays the most minutes for. If she likes both coaches equally, I think playtime during games is a relatively easy way to determine how much that coach likes her back. If we were choosing between team #5 and team #15, I’d take here where she’s going to play. She doesn’t seem to get much out of sitting on the sideline as she does getting burn on the field during games.

If my DD is on the bench for a majority of a game that tells me that when contracts are signed she’s probably at the bottom of the list when it comes to the coach’s signing priority. I want my DD on a good team but I don’t want her to miss making a team entirely because she was the coach’s 15th-best player and 2 better kids came along on the last day of tryouts. If she’s on the field for a majority of each game, that tells me she’s one of the coach’s top priorities to keep.

Some coaches can be crafty wordsmiths and they can tell you everything you need to hear. The proof though is in their actions. If there’s 4 minutes left in a game and your team needs a goal, where’s your DD? If she’s sitting next to you on a lawn chair on the sideline, how does that make her better? When the coach is handing out contracts and there are 25 girls there, will you know your DD will be getting one or will you be left scrambling?
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Post by peacefrog 04/01/12, 09:38 am

B) Is it better to be a star player on the #19 team, or just one of the cogs (not standing out) on the #9 team?

Each family needs to evaluate what works for their situation and their DD. A year ago, our situation (and my plan) was to be the former. My '01DD had a different idea. Once she practiced at a higher level, that's what she wanted. She wanted to be and play like the girls on the higher level team. "Those girls know how to receive a pass, they know how to make a pass." She was willing to take her turn on the bench to take her game to the next level. "My real friends will still be my friends, but soccer's soccer. It's not about friends." That's what worked for my DD. She wanted the competition.


C) How much does harmony with the parents and the kids really matter? Should you stay on Team Harmony that is ranked #27 or #28, or move to a more difficult situation with crazy competitive parents on team #8. It seems that the higher ranked the team, the more crazy competitive the parents are. Is it simply the price you must pay to be on a top team?

I think in any organized competitive activity, we're going to have crazy parents. Of course, it's always THEM! Never me! Laughing In our move from teams, we left our family. We knew the parents, we knew the girls, we knew the siblings, we knew the coach and club. We knew what to expect in game situations and in social situations. However it didn't take long to get to know the new team. I'm not sure I agree that on the higher ranked team that the parents are any more crazy competitive than on the former team.

I think BW has given some great advice in the form of soul searching questions. Ultimately you should evaluate the situation with some input from your DD.

I was given advice that this is a marathon, not a sprint. I have to remind myself of that constantly.

Good luck!

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Post by berserker13 04/01/12, 10:43 am

deepthoughts wrote:After thinking about the discussion in the 11-25 FBR post and the invaluable contribution of bwgophers (See Post) regarding what happened in the 01 group, I believe the following:

1) The teams already in the top 30 are odds-on-favorites to make Lake Highlands Girls Classic League come summer qualifying tournament - the number of teams ranked below 30 that made it was only one last year

2) Playing in LHGCL gives a DD an improved chance of playing soccer for her high school varsity team over Plano PPL or Arlington - the higher the LH division, the better

3) If a team missed in qualifying, very few teams from Plano or Arlington ever get to LHGCL D3, fewer yet rise to D2, and virtually none make it to LHGCL D1

4) If a team misses in first year qualifying, it get progressively harder in the future as LH reduces the number of teams in the league in older brackets

5) If you have a star kid that dominates in LHGCL D3, Plano, or Arlington -- you need to move up to another team the following year -- your odds are much better moving your DD than your team moving up a league.

6) Even now, the same dynamic holds true -- Parents of "star" kids and "very good" kids on teams below #25 are best served by trying out for teams ranked 1 - 20 -- being in the top 20 seems to virtually guarantee the all-important Lake Highlands qualification, barring a total team meltdown. Few teams will displace top 20 teams in this final spring season before going select.


So far, I think the top points are pretty much set in stone. If anyone disagrees, please comment.

Here are the questions that I do have:

A) Is it better to be a bench sub getting a bit less than 50% play time on a top 10 team, or a starter on a 10 - 25 team?

B) Is it better to be a star player on the #19 team, or just one of the cogs (not standing out) on the #9 team?

C) How much does harmony with the parents and the kids really matter? Should you stay on Team Harmony that is ranked #27 or #28, or move to a more difficult situation with crazy competitive parents on team #8. It seems that the higher ranked the team, the more crazy competitive the parents are. Is it simply the price you must pay to be on a top team?

D) Is it easier to move now, before spring starts, or should a person try to play his or her DD on as many teams / guest roles as possible throughout the spring before committing to a team? I have seen a number of parents that have a DD on three teams - does this work out better or worse?

My gut feel is that simply being on a team in the top 20 is what's most important. Being in the top 20 looks like it means you are very likely to not miss out on LH D3, even if the team has a nightmare QTourney. In year one of select, the top 20 teams all compete in the expanded 20 team LH D1 bracket. It does not feel like you must get to a top 10 or top 5 team right now. What are your thoughts?

I think it all depends on what you want for your DD. I think the question is more complicated that simple answers to each of your questions, they all factor togather along with other intangibles to lean you one way or the other. Playing time is more important for development that simply being on a higher level team, in my opinion, but the factors of being with a great group of parents and coach, or the girls being friends, and is your DD having fun all factor in.

Development for your DD is key, and the coach is probably the biggest factor there. Club or league doesn't matter so much. If your DD is getting playing time and developing and you are happy, all is well.

I would like to address a couple of your assumptions though from my experience, specifically #3 & 4: My older daughter's team failed to qualify for LH three straight years by 1 goal (either a 1-0 loss or 0-0 tie changed would have qualified them). The team dominated in PPL and would routinely beat LH teams in tournaments, but just had a bad weekend each year during the QT. The 4th year they made D3, and rose to a close 3rd place and were prompted to D2 because of D1 teams leaving for ECNL. This 5th year they are in currently in 1st place in D2 and would be promoted to D1 if the season ended right now. So it can be done.

There is also going to be turnover every year. On my older DD's team there are only 2 girls that were on the team at U11, and only 2 (my DD being one) that are still there that joined in U12.

The bottom line is it isn't the end of the world if you're not on a LH team at U11, even PPL teams and small clubs have girls that make it to college soccer, it is indeed a marathon, not a sprint, you can always switch horses later, make your decision based on your DD's happiness and development, not on prestige for a particular league or club.
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