Focus Change to Winning Now?

As the girls go to select from Academy is there a noticeable change in the coaches behavior? Do they start to focus more on winning trophies and establishing a good team record over trynig to develop individual players? Do the folks on the bench play less and the game is mainly played by the starting 11?

Some questions for those that have been there?

RunsLikeWind wrote:As the girls go to select from Academy is there a noticeable change in the coaches behavior? Do they start to focus more on winning trophies and establishing a good team record over trynig to develop individual players? Do the folks on the bench play less and the game is mainly played by the starting 11?

Some questions for those that have been there?

Yes winning becomes more important and playing time shifts towards the players that can help you win. However, for some coaches, this is not a noticeable change.

Blitzed wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:As the girls go to select from Academy is there a noticeable change in the coaches behavior? Do they start to focus more on winning trophies and establishing a good team record over trynig to develop individual players? Do the folks on the bench play less and the game is mainly played by the starting 11?

Some questions for those that have been there?

Yes winning becomes more important and playing time shifts towards the players that can help you win. However, for some coaches, this is not a noticeable change.

Personally... I wouldn't take my DD to a "Winning is important now" Coach. I want her to develop her skills, gameplay, and soccer knowledge NOW. These next 2-3 years are so crucial for development that I want to make sure she has the right coach for that type of development. Shoot... if she loses some games along the way, fine. If the coach is teaching proper soccer play... ball movement, possession soccer, etc... then, that is the way for my DD. If the coach is "win, win, win" and "boot it up to our crazy fast forward" then no... not the team for my DD. That team will be crushed in 2-3 years by the team that worked on individual foot skills, possession, and their soccer knowledge/confidence. Let those teams win their trophies now with the track star up front... all of our girls touch the ball during the game and will keep working on their 1v1 battles.

Just my 2 cents...

Bierluva wrote:Personally... I wouldn't take my DD to a "Winning is important now" Coach. I want her to develop her skills, gameplay, and soccer knowledge NOW. These next 2-3 years are so crucial for development that I want to make sure she has the right coach for that type of development. Shoot... if she loses some games along the way, fine. If the coach is teaching proper soccer play... ball movement, possession soccer, etc... then, that is the way for my DD. If the coach is "win, win, win" and "boot it up to our crazy fast forward" then no... not the team for my DD. That team will be crushed in 2-3 years by the team that worked on individual foot skills, possession, and their soccer knowledge/confidence. Let those teams win their trophies now with the track star up front... all of our girls touch the ball during the game and will keep working on their 1v1 battles.

Just my 2 cents...

Winning! Now!

RunsLikeWind wrote:As the girls go to select from Academy is there a noticeable change in the coaches behavior? Do they start to focus more on winning trophies and establishing a good team record over trynig to develop individual players? Do the folks on the bench play less and the game is mainly played by the starting 11?

Some questions for those that have been there?

since you asked.....yes, select is competitive soccer, the best kids play the most,half a game playing time is history. kids who are the weakest, sit the bench..alot. that is why it is important to find a good fit for your kid. your kid may play on the academy team now and not get asked to be on the select team. find out exactly what your coach thinks about your DD. don't assume anything.

qualifying tournament is all about winning. If you are lucky enough to make D1 and your coach is good then he can make sure he wins enough so he can spend time developing. But at the end of the day welcome to competative soccer. You are either developing or waiting for a kid who is to come take your spot

RunsLikeWind wrote:As the girls go to select from Academy is there a noticeable change in the coaches behavior? Do they start to focus more on winning trophies and establishing a good team record over trynig to develop individual players? Do the folks on the bench play less and the game is mainly played by the starting 11?

Some questions for those that have been there?

Hmmm, I saw a lot of kids spending a lot of time on the bench in this last PT Academy tournament.

CharlieSheen's Brain wrote:

Bierluva wrote:Personally... I wouldn't take my DD to a "Winning is important now" Coach. I want her to develop her skills, gameplay, and soccer knowledge NOW. These next 2-3 years are so crucial for development that I want to make sure she has the right coach for that type of development. Shoot... if she loses some games along the way, fine. If the coach is teaching proper soccer play... ball movement, possession soccer, etc... then, that is the way for my DD. If the coach is "win, win, win" and "boot it up to our crazy fast forward" then no... not the team for my DD. That team will be crushed in 2-3 years by the team that worked on individual foot skills, possession, and their soccer knowledge/confidence. Let those teams win their trophies now with the track star up front... all of our girls touch the ball during the game and will keep working on their 1v1 battles.

Just my 2 cents...

Winning! Now!

Well with tiger blood in your veins... you are always WINNING!

go99 wrote:qualifying tournament is all about winning. If you are lucky enough to make D1 and your coach is good then he can make sure he wins enough so he can spend time developing. But at the end of the day welcome to competative soccer. You are either developing or waiting for a kid who is to come take your spot

I have no problem with the coach changing the focus to winning as a team. My daughter has played for a number of different teams during academy ages and some were focussed on winning and some on skills, developing players and did not care as much about team scores or winning league games and tournaments.

I hope the focus shifts to winning and being the best they can be now that they are select. I agree that this is competitive soccer and the best players should play, and the team should always play for the win. The years spent on teams that cared more about skills, individual players etc were tough when you were always getting beat. I think at Academy age there should be a mixed focus on winning and player development but once you are select, the coach should play to win every game.

I anticipate my daughter will quit in a few years when grades, extra curricular HS activities, cheerleading, boys and other activites heat up, so now is the time to see how a good a team can be.

but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

you don't need select soccer for that. she can learn that on other teams and save you 2500 a year.....

silentparent wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

you don't need select soccer for that. she can learn that on other teams and save you 2500 a year.....

We tried the rec route and it was extremely frustrating. Played up a year and that just led her to getting kicked in the shin by larger girls. Select soccer is what you make of it, (I think) and my daughter is looking forward to it. Just hoping the intensity is taken up a little and the coaches play to win....

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

What what after all that you put in the real truth. The fact that she enjoys it is what it's all about for her. The entire rest of that paragraph was for you. Kids play because they have fun. The lesson to learn is how to work hard and compete as an individual. If all you need is winning then just put her on the best team out there and she will win regardless of her efforts. But the funny thing is I seem to remember hearing this same argument very loudly a few years ago on the boys side of things. But as they got older and pre academy came along the screams of "win now baby" seemed to disappear. It must be heart breaking to watch a kid quit something they love doing because they were failed by bad coaching and parents who were more interested in the teams results than their own kid.

go99 wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

What what after all that you put in the real truth. The fact that she enjoys it is what it's all about for her. The entire rest of that paragraph was for you. Kids play because they have fun. The lesson to learn is how to work hard and compete as an individual. If all you need is winning then just put her on the best team out there and she will win regardless of her efforts. But the funny thing is I seem to remember hearing this same argument very loudly a few years ago on the boys side of things. But as they got older and pre academy came along the screams of "win now baby" seemed to disappear. It must be heart breaking to watch a kid quit something they love doing because they were failed by bad coaching and parents who were more interested in the teams results than their own kid.

I see what you are saying but I think it is all an individual decision for each kid and family (fairly obvious). In shopping my kid around to different teams, she has developed quite well as an individual and I expect her to start and play most of the game on a top team. IF she did not play at least 80% of the game, we would not be on that team. I expect her to stay at the top of her age group in terms of individual player ability, or we will not play. I put these expectations on her, because I have seen what she can do and how it has made her a very good player. That is my point, I now have the same expections for her team once they go select. If the coach does not win, and the team does not excell, we will look for a team that does.

However, maybe because she is my kid or she is just used to high expections, the pressure has not effected her and she has done very well. Having said that, she has a number of other interests and soccer is number 3 or 4 on the list and I don't think it will make the cut in a few years.

RunsLikeWind wrote:...or just exceptionally skilled with the ball...

How will your DD become exceptionally skilled with the ball if her talent and skills aren't developed by a coach that only wants to focus on winning? If you just want to prove to everyone your DD can run faster, have her run track. If you want your DD to prove to everyone she can kick the ball hard, save her for the NFL's annual Punt, Pass & Kick challenge.

bigtex75081 wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:...or just exceptionally skilled with the ball...

How will your DD become exceptionally skilled with the ball if her talent and skills aren't developed by a coach that only wants to focus on winning? If you just want to prove to everyone your DD can run faster, have her run track. If you want your DD to prove to everyone she can kick the ball hard, save her for the NFL's annual Punt, Pass & Kick challenge.

The same way she has been doing it for the last several years. At home with me and with friends and older brothers. She has gotten where she is with skills not because of a team coach. We have spent extra time with skills coaches, and the main thing is time in the yard at home. A requirement at our house is that if you are going to participate in something, you will be the best you can. That includes practicing everyday. She has done this for the last few years and she can dribble circles around most girls her age.

I don't pay a team coach to develop her indiviudal skills. That is up to her and me and her skills coaches. I pay a team coach to coach her team tactically, put the right players on the field, motivate and get results. I know this sound harsh but it has worked well so far and I expect it will continue to work. Just need to make sure the coach has the right philosophy.

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:

go99 wrote:but the problem is youth soccer is a team sport but it is also an individual sport. There is no need to win "every" game. There should be a balance and it should lean towards making the kids better. Without that development you daughter will leave soccer alright, but she will leave because she is not good enough to keep up. It's the win win mentality that leads to poor play and kick and run soccer. It's just a shortcut to wins.

I often hear people say the best teams in the older age groups are more kick and run teams. They must be doing something right.

My focus is not on making soccer better in the US or tryign to turn my kid into a college soccer player or any of the other lofty gooals some on this forum seem to argue about. I want my kid to learn how to work hard, compete, be the best they can be and never settle for anything less. That focus should include trying to win every game and the undertanding that the best players (whether they ar fast, big, strong, etc, or just exceptionally skilled with the ball) will play the most. It is a learning grounds for real life. We live in a performance based sociaty and winning has a tangible value. 11 may a little early to teach that lesson but it will come sooner rather than later. That is what soccer is about for my daughter. And the fact she enjoys it.

What what after all that you put in the real truth. The fact that she enjoys it is what it's all about for her. The entire rest of that paragraph was for you. Kids play because they have fun. The lesson to learn is how to work hard and compete as an individual. If all you need is winning then just put her on the best team out there and she will win regardless of her efforts. But the funny thing is I seem to remember hearing this same argument very loudly a few years ago on the boys side of things. But as they got older and pre academy came along the screams of "win now baby" seemed to disappear. It must be heart breaking to watch a kid quit something they love doing because they were failed by bad coaching and parents who were more interested in the teams results than their own kid.

I see what you are saying but I think it is all an individual decision for each kid and family (fairly obvious). In shopping my kid around to different teams, she has developed quite well as an individual and I expect her to start and play most of the game on a top team. IF she did not play at least 80% of the game, we would not be on that team. I expect her to stay at the top of her age group in terms of individual player ability, or we will not play. I put these expectations on her, because I have seen what she can do and how it has made her a very good player. That is my point, I now have the same expections for her team once they go select. If the coach does not win, and the team does not excell, we will look for a team that does.

However, maybe because she is my kid or she is just used to high expections, the pressure has not effected her and she has done very well. Having said that, she has a number of other interests and soccer is number 3 or 4 on the list and I don't think it will make the cut in a few years.

I understand what you are saying. The time for everyone plays equal amount of time is over. And actually not even because of the wins. It drives the girls to work hard in practice and pushes them to excel. The coach should be trying to win but hopefully not at the sacrifice of the players. YOu have described the lesson to be learned. Work hard and give everything your best effort. some they will win others they will lose. If you want to see a kids true character see what they do under the pressure of a few losses. We are all heros when everything is going well. The true test is who rises under the pressure cooker of adversity.

I pay a team coach to coach her team tactically, put the right players on the field, motivate and get results


LMAO, you will not get a good coach who focuses on tactics at this age. it sounds like you will very much get the team you deserve, and not in a good way. but cheer up you can text the coach during the game and tell him your expectations, which i suspect you already do....

RunsLikeWind wrote:

bigtex75081 wrote:

RunsLikeWind wrote:...or just exceptionally skilled with the ball...

How will your DD become exceptionally skilled with the ball if her talent and skills aren't developed by a coach that only wants to focus on winning? If you just want to prove to everyone your DD can run faster, have her run track. If you want your DD to prove to everyone she can kick the ball hard, save her for the NFL's annual Punt, Pass & Kick challenge.

The same way she has been doing it for the last several years. At home with me and with friends and older brothers. She has gotten where she is with skills not because of a team coach. We have spent extra time with skills coaches, and the main thing is time in the yard at home. A requirement at our house is that if you are going to participate in something, you will be the best you can. That includes practicing everyday. She has done this for the last few years and she can dribble circles around most girls her age.

I don't pay a team coach to develop her indiviudal skills. That is up to her and me and her skills coaches. I pay a team coach to coach her team tactically, put the right players on the field, motivate and get results. I know this sound harsh but it has worked well so far and I expect it will continue to work. Just need to make sure the coach has the right philosophy.

Almost right but in reality you pay a coach to develope her skills too your just isn't doing it. Also as far as tactics go you also pay him to teach her the game at a tactical level that is sustainable. This is where many coaches fail. They teach tactics that will win now but then the players are not competative later. But definitely correct that the most important work is done at home.

silentparent wrote:I pay a team coach to coach her team tactically, put the right players on the field, motivate and get results


LMAO, you will not get a good coach who focuses on tactics at this age. it sounds like you will very much get the team you deserve, and not in a good way. but cheer up you can text the coach during the game and tell him your expectations, which i suspect you already do....

No texting during the game here. The coach doesn't live up to his end of the deal, we simply leave. No arguments, no badgering about playing time, very little communication with the coach. He does his job, or we move on. Makes it very easy.

Like I said, each parent must structure it for his/her child. Fortunately, my child can walk on most teams and play so there is no reason to try and bug the coach or "suck up" for lack of a better team. By the way, I think most kids could be much better than they are if they did not rely on these super coaches to teach their kids "skills" and simply required their kids to put forth a decent effort at the sport.

Have seen way too many kids at the Academy level that you can tell only practice when the team is together twice a week and never touch the ball at home. The parents then complain the coach is not teaching their daughters skills and only want to win. That is the main point for my post. I hope these kids are weeded out by the time we go select.

The coach doesn't live up to his end of the deal, we simply leave. No arguments, no badgering about playing time, very little communication with the coach. He does his job, or we move on. Makes it very easy.


its a slow news day, so i will bite. what is his job? what has been his job up until this point?

silentparent wrote:The coach doesn't live up to his end of the deal, we simply leave. No arguments, no badgering about playing time, very little communication with the coach. He does his job, or we move on. Makes it very easy.


its a slow news day, so i will bite. what is his job? what has been his job up until this point?

You busted me for giving you my thoughts on his job above. At the select level, Teach tactics, put the right players on the field, get results. I would also throw in recruit good talent to the team.

At the Academy level, I think a coach is there to organize a team, evaluate players and let them know their strenghts and weaknesses, put the kids in positions to be succesfull, motivate them to train and work hard, set up training sessions that work on group skills and indiviudal skills as well, create an atmosphere of competition, coach to win on game days but also to work on certain aspects of individual performance. ( Ie, promote risk taking with the ball, encourage trying new things learned in practice) teach them what they did wrong and how to correc it.

These are just a few the things a coach is paid to do.

sounds good to me