Guess Players Again - Solar Nero - Club Pass

Whatever you think of CPP the only way it will be changed or revoked is if the parents of the big clubs( it actually only requires 2 teams) don't like it and revolt against it.When a team uses CPP players only that team actually knows the real reasons and if the parents of that team are Ok with it the rule will stand.On the other hand parents that feel their DD is being slighted then they will start to make a rumble.They may start insisting the coaches/club don't use it or more likely they will take there business elsewhere. We will know in a year or two how this plays out.

rockindaddy wrote:We will know in a year or two how this plays out.

Is CPP new?

Cobra_Kai wrote:

rockindaddy wrote:We will know in a year or two how this plays out.

 Is CPP new?

Looks like they implemented it in 2011:

http://www.usyouthsoccer.org/news/us_youth_soccer_introduces_club_pass/

Is the 'obuse' new?

LH first started implementing CPP last year, and there were a few rumblings back then. If memory serves, NTX implemented half a season earlier, giving the NTX leagues the green light to use it.

Cobra_Kai wrote:Is the 'obuse' new?

Only for the abtuse...

Just looking around on other State Soccer Association sites it looks like some states have been using it for quite awhile and experience much the same heartache...  some love it, some hate it, some could care less.  Some states have no limitations on it's use while others limit it's use to moving players up or across, not down.  Some states have penalties for it's "abusive" use while others just leave it wide open for interpretation.  Other states, I'm noticing, are still in Academy until U13 and implement player pass in a completely different manner.  Some states appear to be using the same rules the Boys in NTX utilize (for the most part).  You can CPP up in division / age group but you can not CPP down.  However, there is no limit in the number of players you can CPP...  Some states seem to even allow CPP for tournaments.  I like the way it's being justified as a "development" tool.  How does one delineate between "development" and "I want a win".  Seems kinda difficult from ages U11-U13 cause isn't everything development for these kids in these age groups?

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

Just to be sure I understand what the whining is about today. U12 players playing up(in age) played down(in division)? What if SRSA 03 were still playing u12 and the players played in the game? Would you still be up in arms about CPP? Probably so, because your team didn't win a game that you had penciled in the W column.

Player pass was implemented for the first time within LHGCL last spring.  It was approved by NTSSA well before that, not really sure when.  

When CPP was discussed at the LH's meeting with all the team reps present (yes, it was a big meeting, yes the discussion was heated) all the current issues we are experiencing were brought to light. The LH's board assured everyone at the meeting that they would be watching how this rule was used closely and that the penalties for violating the "spirit of the rule" (pause for laughter)............................................................................................................................... would be severe. I could try to state this in some politically correct way via verbal gymnastics, but the truth is, we were lied to.

The single largest proponent of this rule, at that meeting, was STING. This is not an opinion, this is a fact. Sting championed this rule. Dallas Texans were also supportive of it, but Sting was the one club that was pushing hard for this rule.

Terrible rule. It is being used in EXACTLY the fashion we we're told would NOT be allowed.

With the assurances provided by the board above, I still don't understand why they didn't just put copy the rule as implemented by boy's classic.

I don't know. I also don't know why board member's team affiliation is not listed. I am very interested to know exactly who is representing me within this private league. We are all "members" in LHGCL, according to the bylaws. As a member, I'd like to know who is representing me. I suspect the answer is no one. That also brings up the question, who is being represented? Look at the rules and you can come to some very specific answers about who is being represented.

futbollove wrote:

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

Just to be sure I understand what the whining is about today. U12 players playing up(in age) played down(in division)?  What if SRSA 03 were still playing u12 and the players played in the game? Would you still be up in arms about CPP? Probably so, because your team didn't win a game that you had penciled in the W column.

If you cannot "understand" the problems with this rule and the way it is being abused then I question your mental fortitude or your sense of right and wrong.  Since I choose to see the good in people, I will assume the problem with you not  "getting it" is the former. While winning does matter to every team (brilliant statement by the way)  the issue is with fair play and level playing fields.  My six year old can understand that this is basically cheating to win.  

"The coach is just saying my team is just not good enough. But what do they care as long as they get their paycheck."

WINNER WINNER CHICKEN DINNER!!!

ChuckNorris wrote:

futbollove wrote:

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

Just to be sure I understand what the whining is about today. U12 players playing up(in age) played down(in division)?  What if SRSA 03 were still playing u12 and the players played in the game? Would you still be up in arms about CPP? Probably so, because your team didn't win a game that you had penciled in the W column.

If you cannot "understand" the problems with this rule and the way it is being abused then I question your mental fortitude or your sense of right and wrong.  Since I choose to see the good in people, I will assume the problem with you not  "getting it" is the former. While winning does matter to every team (brilliant statement by the way)  the issue is with fair play and level playing fields.  My six year old can understand that this is basically cheating to win.  

since that tragic boating accident futbollove has had problems with basic comprehension of most issues, hopefully soon he will recover to a six year olds understanding...

ChuckNorris wrote:

futbollove wrote:

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

Just to be sure I understand what the whining is about today. U12 players playing up(in age) played down(in division)?  What if SRSA 03 were still playing u12 and the players played in the game? Would you still be up in arms about CPP? Probably so, because your team didn't win a game that you had penciled in the W column.

If you cannot "understand" the problems with this rule and the way it is being abused then I question your mental fortitude or your sense of right and wrong.  Since I choose to see the good in people, I will assume the problem with you not  "getting it" is the former. While winning does matter to every team (brilliant statement by the way)  the issue is with fair play and level playing fields.  My six year old can understand that this is basically cheating to win.  

I absolutely get what your whining is about, just don't agree with it. Play who is in front of you and quit crying. Is there abuse of the rule going on, certainly. Is the rule being used in the way it was intended, yes to that as well. But to complain about a younger player being player-passed?? Come on man!!

futbollove wrote:

ChuckNorris wrote:

futbollove wrote:

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

Just to be sure I understand what the whining is about today. U12 players playing up(in age) played down(in division)?  What if SRSA 03 were still playing u12 and the players played in the game? Would you still be up in arms about CPP? Probably so, because your team didn't win a game that you had penciled in the W column.

If you cannot "understand" the problems with this rule and the way it is being abused then I question your mental fortitude or your sense of right and wrong.  Since I choose to see the good in people, I will assume the problem with you not  "getting it" is the former. While winning does matter to every team (brilliant statement by the way)  the issue is with fair play and level playing fields.  My six year old can understand that this is basically cheating to win.  

I absolutely get what your whining is about, just don't agree with it. Play who is in front of you and quit crying. Is there abuse of the rule going on, certainly. Is the rule being used in the way it was intended, yes to that as well. But to complain about a younger player being player-passed?? Come on man!!

They're not complaining about an '03 player being CPP'd down to a U13 ('02) DIII team. They're complaining about an '03 player good enough to compete at the top of '02 DII (and probably next year DI) playing 'down' with the U11 ('03) team. Clear violation of the 'spirit of the rule'.

In that case, shame on Solar. Definitely NOT what the rule is intended for. Even I can't defend em on this one.

Solar is definitely abusing this pass. For the coach not to have the confidence in his own team that he picked back in July is wrong. The girls sitting the bench have to be wondering as do the parents is this really what we signed up for.

If you can't win with the team you brought to LH go home !!

Seriously01 wrote:Solar is definitely abusing this pass.  For the coach not to have the confidence in his own team that he picked back in July is wrong.  The girls sitting the bench have to be wondering as do the parents is this really what we signed up for.  

Sad...
Blame the bureaucrats at NTSSA and LH, dumber than a bag of hammers, lackey puppets to clubs and too proud to admit they were hoodwinked into a mess.

reccostx wrote:Solar Rush (formally Nero), strikes again and uses 3 guest players, (1 ea. Def, mid & foward) from their 02/03 team to hold Sparta to 0-0 tie. They can't compete so they use a Sunday game to stack their team and hold back an honest team, who can compete, from achieving their just reward. How is the best team to win when you never know who you will be playing. This is no better than the Academy days. Technically, you have to be able to beat the best 02-D2/D1 LH teams in order to finish first in LH 03-D3. It appears they will do just about anything to hopelessly try and hold a top 5 position and keep a Solar team in D3. This is tanamont to cheating. No other way to say it.  They have no regard for honest, hardworking and deserving teams. The boys classic league has the "club pass" rule correct; only players from same or lower division teams can guess play. I have no respect for clubs that use the rule in this manor. This rule is in serious need of modification, if for no other reason than to maintain integrity in the league. LH, please take control back from these shameless club organizations.

"Leges sine moribus vanae" - Laws without morals are vain.

Vain, welcome to lake highlands league!

Zizou wrote:Vain, welcome to lake highlands league!

and the abusers have low morals

Great opinion!

futbollove wrote:In that case, shame on Solar. Definitely NOT what the rule is intended for. Even I can't defend em on this one.

Really with all the snide remarks and stupid Emoticons you have made against those arguing against CPP this is all you have. An apology here would show a little class.

Hard Practice wrote:

futbollove wrote:In that case, shame on Solar. Definitely NOT what the rule is intended for. Even I can't defend em on this one.

Really with all the snide remarks and stupid Emoticons you have made against those arguing against CPP this is all you have.  An apology here would show a little class.

So you think that because one team used the rule in bad taste, legally I might add, that that is enough to do away with it all together? Surely that's not your argument. Was CPP used in this instance to get a favorable advantage? Sure looks like it. But neither I, nor you, or anyone other than the coach knows for certain.  I've also seen where CPP was used for, what appears to be, again none of us knows for certain, true development. Are you,in those instances, going to apologize for your disapproval of the rule? After all, that would be the classy thing to do.